With what? With humanity? In many ways, things are going right. We are not as violent as we once were. If someone is offended, we do not demand an eye for an eye, so much, as things once were. We've made great strides in eradicating slavery and oppression.
And yet, in many ways, humanity still has "gone wrong..." We still engage in wars. We still oppress, rape, kill, steal, etc.
We do these things because we are imperfect humans, prone to cause pain. Often times, I think we mistake an evil for a good, as the person who just wants to "save unborn children" who blows up an abortion clinic. Or the person who wants to stop war who, I don't know, blows up a bunch of soldiers.
It is a complex world oftentimes without easy answers and sometimes, we make mistakes. Sometimes, out of an attempt to do the right thing. Sometimes, out of pure selfishness or greed.
How do we explain the origin of evil and suffering?
People make bad choices. As we can observe with our senses.
How do you explain it?
Why can't we all just get along?
Humans are imperfect. We get tired of others' behaviors or mere presence... sometimes for somewhat good motives, sometimes out of just selfishness or greed.
If everything came from God, what happened to make some things/people not good, while some things remain good?
Well, as I've clarified, I don't think it's rational that "bad" came from a Good God. And as I've noted, humans are entirely capable (observably so) of doing bad things. Thus, Good is from/inspired by/willed by God and the Not Good by human error.
This just seems like a rational and observable conclusion.
Do you disagree?
Is good am inherent quality, and what (in a meta sense) is good?
As you know, I don't think that we have a perfectly known and authoritative definition of Good or a perfect understanding of it (hence, part of our problem in doing Not Good so regularly). BUT, I do think that we generally recognize Good and most of humanity has and can agree that Good is that which promotes health, compassion, kindness, strength, forgiveness, grace... whereas Bad is that which does not do those things, but instead, promotes harm (or tears down health), promotes hatred, greed and envy (tearing down compassion, kindness, etc).
Like porn, I think most people can recognize Good when they see it without too much trouble.
Do you think that there will ever be any sort of final setting things to right?
In some sense, things are all the time being set right. People forgive. People save. People intervene and help, setting things to right.
I think perhaps what you're asking is will there ever be a PERFECT, complete and everlasting setting things to right, is that correct?
My answer to that is I don't know objectively for sure, but that is, in my mind, what heaven is, what God's realm is, what being with God - the Perfectly Good and Holy God - is. I tend to believe and take as a matter of faith (but not as a point that can be objectively proven) that when we die and go with God, in that Presence, things are set perfectly aright. But does that happen when we die? Does that happen immediately when we die? One day, after our death in the future??
That is above my pay grade.
Do you know the answer to it?
Or are you suggesting that the best we can hope for is a gradual improvement?
Here on earth? Yes, gradual improvement. I don't see where we can reasonably expect and imperfect humanity to ever do things perfectly right, so I'm hoping for and working for gradual improvement.
For me, that comes from following the teachings of Grace, the teachings of Jesus' Way of Grace.
As to what happens after we die, we have no authoritative source who's explored that arena and can report to us objectively what that might be like.
2 comments:
What has gone wrong?
With what? With humanity? In many ways, things are going right. We are not as violent as we once were. If someone is offended, we do not demand an eye for an eye, so much, as things once were. We've made great strides in eradicating slavery and oppression.
And yet, in many ways, humanity still has "gone wrong..." We still engage in wars. We still oppress, rape, kill, steal, etc.
We do these things because we are imperfect humans, prone to cause pain. Often times, I think we mistake an evil for a good, as the person who just wants to "save unborn children" who blows up an abortion clinic. Or the person who wants to stop war who, I don't know, blows up a bunch of soldiers.
It is a complex world oftentimes without easy answers and sometimes, we make mistakes. Sometimes, out of an attempt to do the right thing. Sometimes, out of pure selfishness or greed.
How do we explain the origin of evil and suffering?
People make bad choices. As we can observe with our senses.
How do you explain it?
Why can't we all just get along?
Humans are imperfect. We get tired of others' behaviors or mere presence... sometimes for somewhat good motives, sometimes out of just selfishness or greed.
Do you have some other explanation?
If everything came from God, what happened to make some things/people not good, while some things remain good?
Well, as I've clarified, I don't think it's rational that "bad" came from a Good God. And as I've noted, humans are entirely capable (observably so) of doing bad things. Thus, Good is from/inspired by/willed by God and the Not Good by human error.
This just seems like a rational and observable conclusion.
Do you disagree?
Is good am inherent quality, and what (in a meta sense) is good?
As you know, I don't think that we have a perfectly known and authoritative definition of Good or a perfect understanding of it (hence, part of our problem in doing Not Good so regularly). BUT, I do think that we generally recognize Good and most of humanity has and can agree that Good is that which promotes health, compassion, kindness, strength, forgiveness, grace... whereas Bad is that which does not do those things, but instead, promotes harm (or tears down health), promotes hatred, greed and envy (tearing down compassion, kindness, etc).
Like porn, I think most people can recognize Good when they see it without too much trouble.
Do you think that there will ever be any sort of final setting things to right?
In some sense, things are all the time being set right. People forgive. People save. People intervene and help, setting things to right.
I think perhaps what you're asking is will there ever be a PERFECT, complete and everlasting setting things to right, is that correct?
My answer to that is I don't know objectively for sure, but that is, in my mind, what heaven is, what God's realm is, what being with God - the Perfectly Good and Holy God - is. I tend to believe and take as a matter of faith (but not as a point that can be objectively proven) that when we die and go with God, in that Presence, things are set perfectly aright. But does that happen when we die? Does that happen immediately when we die? One day, after our death in the future??
That is above my pay grade.
Do you know the answer to it?
Or are you suggesting that the best we can hope for is a gradual improvement?
Here on earth? Yes, gradual improvement. I don't see where we can reasonably expect and imperfect humanity to ever do things perfectly right, so I'm hoping for and working for gradual improvement.
For me, that comes from following the teachings of Grace, the teachings of Jesus' Way of Grace.
As to what happens after we die, we have no authoritative source who's explored that arena and can report to us objectively what that might be like.
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