Let's take a minute an wonder about something. Let's imagine a world where s "fraction" of outlier Christians manipulated Scripture to justify being commanded by Jesus to kill tens/hundreds of thousands of people, invade almost 60 countries and impose "Christian" law, ethnically cleanse those countries resulting in the killing of expulsion of non Christians. Forced non Christians who weren't killed or expelled to pay an onerous tax, oppressed women/children/non Christians, instituted the death penalty for homosexuality and apostasy, raped non Christian women at will, mutilated girls to destroy their ability to enjoy sex, and randomly blew innocent people up. What do we imagine that the response of the "majority" of Christians would be to this "minority"? What are the chances that the "majority"
of Christians would sit by and do nothing? That they would make excuses for their inaction? That they would not point out how those actions did not align with the teachings of YHWH?
Can you imagine a world where a "minority" of Christians actively destroyed the witness of the faith, and the majority didn't act to stop it?
Personally, I cannot. I cannot imagine a "minority" of Christians engaging in barbarism while the "majority" stood by and did nothing.
66 comments:
Craig:
I cannot imagine a "minority" of Christians engaging in barbarism while the "majority" stood by and did nothing.
He said, while voting for a many who keeps killing, abducting and harming people in a wide variety of ways, while standing by along with other conservative religionists and doing nothing.
You are the man, as the Prophet Nathan noted to David.
Having said that, let me be clear: I'm not a Muslim for a reason. The Islamic tradition is problematic for a wide range of reasons, not the least of which is the abuse and oppression of women, girls and LGBTQ folks by SOME PORTIONS of Muslim extremists. AND that too many Muslims are not speaking out against it.
But that's one of the differences between you and I: I recognize that not all Muslims are muslim extremists who abide with the oppression of some Christians, or women, or girls or LGBTQ folks, just like not all Christians are conservative Christian extremists who remain silent after the people they voted for engage in all manners of oppressions.
That the conservative Christian oppressions and abuses today do not reach the level of widespread harm that the extremist Muslim oppressions and abuses is of little consequence to me. "At least we're not as bad as Nazis or Muslim extremists" is a pretty pisspoor low bar to be proclaiming as an accomplishment.
Our religious extremists are HERE, now, in a country where I DO have some say and some responsibility to oppose directly.
Well, I guess I should have expected exactly this nonsense from you.
I do appreciate you agreeing with the premise of the post that millions/billions stand by silently as the majority of the 57 Muslim countries oppress women, children, gays, Christians, Jews and virtually every ethnic and religious minority. I guess you are aware of some of the evil Islam has provided.
Of course you simply make things up with no actual proof or even attempted proof.
But I appreciate your milqutoast half hearted condemnation of Islam, compared to your exaggerated attacks on Trump.
Let’s not forget your silence when P-BO deported and killed significantly more people illegal aliens than Trump, engaged in hundreds of drone strikes, and kept more kids in cages than Trump.
Living in your fantasy world must be special.
Too bad you didn’t actually answer the questions asked.
How widespread does a behavior have to be until you acknowledge that it’s not just “outliers/extremists/a minority”?
Craig...
"I do appreciate you agreeing with the premise of the post that millions/billions stand by silently as the majority of the 57 Muslim countries oppress women, children, gays, Christians..."
And yet,
While your president is an actual felon;
Who has actually boasted about sexually predatory actions towards women and girls;
Who has worked extremely hard to cover up the sexual abuse and pedophilia of his good friend, Epstein;
Whose administration has extrajudically killed hundreds;
Whose administration has harmed/terrorized millions...
You and your conservative religionist allies have remained silent.
THAT is the part you're ignoring.
At least David admitted his sin when he was called on it. Your pride is undoing you. YOU are that man.
Craig...
"How widespread does a behavior have to be until you acknowledge that it’s not just “outliers/extremists/a minority”?"
I have never tried to say how common the abusive/oppressive behaviors are for Muslims. I've just noted the simple reality that not ALL Muslims believe in the oppression endorsed by some/too many.
Just like I haven't placed a number on how many conservative religionists endorse or defend oppression by their president, I've just noted it's way too many.
The problem is, you can't or won't remove the plank from your eye in the face of the evil and oppression of your president.
You are that man.
Those comments were from me, Dan.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2%20Samuel%2012&version=NIV
As to answering your questions... you will hate and ignore the answers, but here they are...
"What do we imagine that the response of the "majority" of Christians would be to this "minority"? What are the chances that the "majority"
of Christians would sit by and do nothing?"
For approximately 1/3 of those Christians in OUR nation, the answer will be silenced, at best and full-throated defense of their oppressive leader, at worst.
The chances are good that roughly 1/3 of those Christians will ignore the abuses, "even if he shot someone dead in broad daylight" as your "profit" foretold, speaking of you.
Dan
Note how Dan isn't a muslim because of the falseness of the "religion" itself, but because so many are butchers and far too many more do nothing about it.
And hey, Craig! Did you vote for an oppressor? I know I didn't? What's this liar mean? I'm gonna guess that he means it's oppressive to enforce the law. It's not oppressive to off 800,000 conceived by yet unborn people. It's not oppressive to force millions to take an unproven drug under threat of termination of employment. It's not oppressive to subject one's own nation to the influx of drugs, human traffickers, murderous gangsters, child abusers, rapists and terrorists. It's not oppressive to force women to accept men in their women only spaces. But enforce the law??? How COULD we?
Art, good point. If it wasn’t for the oppression factor, Dan seems to say that he might be a Muslim. He’d be ok with the magic flying horse thing, or marrying 9 year old girls, but oppression is just too much.
I’m not ignoring anything. I’m also not accepting your lies either.
It’s apples and oranges, and you’re obsessed with Trump, who’ll be out of power in 3 years, but strangely not worried about 57 oppressive regimes throughout the world.
That you cling to this false narrative about Trump and Epstein despite the fact that both the files and reality demonstrate otherwise appears to simply be a monomaniacal Trump hatred.
Based on your above, it’s entirely likely that it’s 90% of Muslims who go along with the teachings of the Quran, and you’ll cling to the “not all”. Nice try.
Your obsession is showing.
I won’t ignore your nonsense, I will pity your monomaniacal obsession.
It’s hilarious that Dan isn’t bothered enough to do anything but make excuses when Muslim countries actually are oppressing and killing large numbers of people, but obsesses about Trump enforcing laws that have been on the books for decades at lower levels that P-BO did. But Dan didn’t complain about P-BO.
Here's a perfect instance where you demonstrate a subpar reading comprehension. I had said:
Having said that, let me be clear:
I'm not a Muslim for a reason.
The Islamic tradition is problematic
for a wide range of reasons,
not the least of which is the abuse and oppression of women, girls and LGBTQ folks by SOME PORTIONS of Muslim extremists. AND that too many Muslims are not speaking out against it.
Marshal and Craig responded with...
Note how Dan isn't a muslim because of the falseness of the "religion" itself, but because so many are butchers and far too many more do nothing about it.
I clearly noted that there were a wide range of reasons. And indeed, a group of religionists who allow/support oppression ARE following a false religion. As the apostle James noted: True religion supports the widows and orphans, the poor and oppressed...." (paraphrase from memory. )
And that sort of false religion is not limited to some in Islamic traditions.
Read for understanding, sirs.
Dan
There is no oppression by our current president, and Pervert Dan the Liar hasn't given fact-based examples of any.
Still no fact-based examples of "oppression" by our current president. Only desperate claims it exists. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Dan is still referring to law enforcement operations as examples of oppression, just as every lawbreaker does when held to account.
That's because Dan's "compassion" is theater and posturing. It's not sincere at all.
I understand that you have problems with sarcasm, snark, and hyperbole (unless you’re using hyperbole as an excuse), but your inability to comprehend those things isn’t my problem.
If Trump’s actions in enforcement of immigration laws is “oppressive”, then P-BO was significantly more “oppressive” yet we didn’t hear this crap from Dan during his 8 years.
The simple fact is that you only mentioned “oppression” as the reason you’re not Muslim. This could reasonably be interpreted to mean that if Islam could get a handle on that one thing, that you’d be all in.
I can see why the magic horsey story would appeal to you as long with the hatred for dogs.
Maybe there’s a theological reason that explains the “oppression”, and their insistence on imposing an Islamic theocracy in every country they conquer. Maybe the fact that there are Muslim leaders actively pushing for an Islamic takeover of the US and Western Europe should be something you’re aware of,
Craig:
It’s hilarious that Dan isn’t bothered enough to do anything but make excuses when Muslim countries actually are oppressing and killing large numbers of people
1. I've made no excuses. Period. It's a stupidly false claim and bullshit slander - the sort of thing that is contrary to biblical teachings for your magic rulebook type religionists.
I just tend to not comment on other country's problems/oppressions... JUST LIKE YOU don't typically comment on other nations and their oppression EXCEPT, sometimes, when the oppressor is Muslim (but not Jewish) OR the victims identify as some form of Christianity.
2. But here's your chance: In Christian-dominant nations like Uganda or Kenya, being gay is criminalized and thus, gay folk are oppressed by those nations. Also in many Muslim nations. Where are your posts condemning Christian nations oppressing gay folk?
Also, many of those Christian dominant nations in Africa have patriarchal laws that harm or oppress women. Where are your posts condemning that?
What's that? You're not "bothered enough" to complain when it's nominally Christian's doing the oppressing?
Well, of course, not. We see that here in your OWN nation, when you turn a blind eye to the oppressions and injustices of the conservative religionists' king.
And that you two are unaware of the oppression happening in this nation by your president is just proof of the point. It's happening. You don't see it.
START by removing the plank from your eyes.
You are the man.
1. Yet you’ve made multiple excuses for staying silent on what’s happening. Most recently your “it’s not here” excuse.
2. Coming from someone who rarely, if ever, specifically condemns Muslim atrocities, this is a cute way to deflect from your silence. I’ve been consistent for years about criminalizing homosexuality. I’ll gladly say right here and now that I disagree with any country that criminalizes homosexuality. That’s the difference between us, I have no reason to excuse or ignore things.
Given your vast knowledge (or what you learned in your quick google search) what is the punishment for being gay in those countries?
I’ll give you credit, instead of acknowledging your silence and excuses for the depredations of Islam, you attack me.
You do have one thing right, you’re making a false equivalence between Islamic theocratic regimes governing under Sharia, and “nominally” Christian countries who are not theocratic.
Apples/oranges.
Pot.
Marshal:
Did you vote for an oppressor? I know I didn't? What's this liar mean? I'm gonna guess that he means it's oppressive to enforce the law.
Yes. Yes, you both did. Repeatedly, but certainly in 2024.
This idiot conman has had his people...
KILL two innocent protesters. Protesting is not punished by death. THAT is oppression.
Abduct untold numbers of people for questionable cause - the vast majority of which were not criminals and certainly not violent criminals. THAT is oppression.
Used children to try to abduct innocent people. THAT is oppression.
Created an atmosphere of fear and terror - ie, literally terrorism - by his racist profiling to stop and pick up and abduct/disappear people for being Latino or looking foreign. THAT is oppression.
Repeatedly blocked and attacked efforts to release files related to sexual predators and pedophiles. THAT is oppression.
Demonized LGBTQ folks. THAT is oppression - something that Muslim extremists, Christian extremists and Nazis all have in common.
Attacked and demonized the free press. THAT is oppression and part of the path of authoritarians.
Literally committed extrajudicial executions of people in international waters. No jury. No trial. No chance to surrender. NO PROOF that they were actually drug dealers AND EVEN IF THEY WERE (doubtful), that is not a capitol offense. THAT is oppression.
That you are blind to the oppression or ignorant of WHY it is oppression doesn't change the reality.
And on it goes and you all remain silent and complicit.
As long as the term "oppressor" as it relates to Trump remains undefined, this is just Dan engaged in slander.
Trump did not order the deaths of two protesters. Neither were the protesters "innocent", in the sense that they played no part in the events that led to their deaths.
Well, let's start with the fact that P-BO "abducted" significantly more and killed significantly more while enforcing the exact same laws Trump is enforcing. I guess that makes P-BO an "oppressor" too, right? The "due process" for anyone who enters the US illegally is deportation, so simply enforcing the appropriate "due process" for the violation is not "oppression". I've posted, and will continue to post the toll of the Biden administration's immigration policies combined with a "justice" system that releases people with multiple felonies onto the streets to offend again. Still not oppression.
I can't take unproven bullshit like this seriously.
Speaking as someone who's been on the streets, in the neighborhoods, where all of this terror is allegedly happening, I can say that I haven't seen it. I'll simply note that if you have violated US immigration law and believe that you might get the appropriate "due process", then some degree of fear is appropriate.
When you insist on spewing conspiracy theories that literally contradict observable reality, your commitment to a narrative over Truth shows through. Up to this point, only one POTUS has authorized the release of the Epstein files.
WTF? Trump is probably the most pro LGB president the GOP has ever elected.
Yeah, criticizing the MSM who've shown an increasing tendency to fail at their primary purpose is a horrible thing. Yet, the MSM still exist. They haven't had their FCC licenses revoked, haven't been forced to censor dissenting viewpoints (that was Biden), and Trump has done more interviews, press conferences, and press availabilities than Biden, despite the MSM being solidly opposed to him.
P-BO killed more people with drone strikes than Trump has, including at least on family of US citizens.
The problem with your list is that so much of it simply does not comport with reality, and if highlights your silence about some of the same things you now call "oppression" during the P-BO and Biden administrations.
If Trump was the oppressor you claim, we wouldn't have had to deal with weeks of idiots protesting and engaging in illegal actions here in the TC.
I believe that it is safe to say that the Islamic Government in Iran is one of the top 5 most "oppressive" governments on earth. Yet the UN, and organization Dan seems very enamored with recently congratulated them on the violent overthrow of the previous legitimate government and was named vice chair of the UN Commission for Social Development. This body is intended to promote democracy, gender equality, tolerance and non-violence. Given the Iranian regime's total opposition to all of those things, it seems strange that the UN would honor them in such a way.
If you want to see oppression, look at the tens of thousands of protesters who were killed for peacefully protesting. Or take a look at what the Iranian regime has done to Melika Azizi. Look at how a real "oppressive" regime works, then compare and contrast.
Again, "at least the US under this administration is not as bad as Iran, not as bad as the Nazis, etc..." is not a good look.
Rational adults don't want to be even a little authoritarian and "only" kill dozens of people, only imprison or oppress thousands of people.
A "little authoritarianism" has traditionally been a stepping stone. Students of history know this.
The problem here is not whether or not various presidents have done things, it’s your overreaction to Trump for doing things that P-BO ( to a lesser degree than P-BO).
It’s all about your double standard, nothing else.
I suspect you’ll now claim that you objected when P-BO did these kinds of things, the problem you have is a lack of actual evidence of your outrage at the time.
You know what’s not a good look? You making these sorts of bullshit claims. Typical straw man garbage.
To expand a bit on my point. The problem is that when you refer to the US in terms of "authoritarian/oppressive/fascist" you draw an equivalency between the US and countries which actually are "authoritarian/oppressive/fascist". Much like other terms overused by the ASPL (racist being a case in point), their actual meaning becomes diluted. When enforcing long standing US law, in the same way multiple other presidents have enforced said law becomes "oppressive" when one president does it, then the term "oppressive" ceases to have any actual meaning. When you and your ilk sit silently by when actual "oppressive" regimes engage in actual "oppression", then go crazy when Trump simply enforces US law, you look unhinged. To silently sit by while actual "oppression" is happening, while screeching about fake oppression, simply makes your screeching look like TDS, not like actual opposition to "oppression".
I'll simply note that you chose a straw man response to my comment, totally misrepresenting what I actually said, rather than anything of substance on a subject that should be appalling to someone who is against "oppression".
"Yes. Yes, you both did. Repeatedly, but certainly in 2024."
No. Neither of us did. Ever. Not in 2024 or any other year.
"This idiot conman has had his people..."
Neither Obama, Biden, Clinton or any other Democrat/leftist/marxist/progressive (same things) are in office now. Trump is and conmen don't con by fulfilling campaign promises as well as has Trump. If Trump is conning us, there's been no American who's had anything but suffering taken from this conman...suffering caused by the true conman: the Democrat/leftist/marxist/progressive (same things).
"KILL two innocent protesters. Protesting is not punished by death. THAT is oppression."
This is a blatant lie intentionally told by our resident liar. First, as mentioned, Trump ordered no one to kill anyone, so Dan lies and libels. Second, neither Pretti nor Good were "innocent" and "protester" is far less than what they truly were. To protest is to expression disapproval or objection to something. These two went far beyond expressing their disapproval. They willfully engaged in criminal acts to obstruct the lawful operations of ICE. They were willfully and arrogantly aiding and abetting criminal behavior. Both were repeat offenders. Their deaths were the result of their own choices to willfully engage in truly felonious behavior.
"Abduct untold numbers of people for questionable cause - the vast majority of which were not criminals and certainly not violent criminals. THAT is oppression."
That is another blatant lie intentionally told by Dan the liar. ICE doesn't "abduct", so again Dan libels officers of the law for daring to arrest and detain those who warrant such legal due processes. That the number of them was not "told" to Dan, they are not unknown, and ICE can and has provided the numbers of people arrested/detained and/or deported. All arrested were criminals, even if their known crime was only their illegal entry into our country. Those who commit only misdemeanors are referred to as "petty criminals" because despite the severity of their crime, breaking the law makes one a criminal. So, all ICE arrests are of those who broke the law.
continuing...
Picking up where I left off, I wish to add this: Let's say Jesus crossed the border without going through the proper justly established protocols for legal immigration or travel. I don't mean Jesus as in "Hey! Zeus!". I mean the Only Begotten Son of God. He crosses and cannot produce ID proving He has a legal right or permission to be here. He's deserving of detainment/arrest and deportation.
Dan knows full well that the plan was to go after the worst first and NOT the worst only. If he didn't know that (though it's been stated here as the fact it is more than once), then he's arrogant to dare speak on the issue as if he's informed enough to do so.
"Used children to try to abduct innocent people. THAT is oppression."
Another abject lie intentionally told. At best, it's another case of Dan assuming the worst about that for which he has no knowledge because of his grace embracing eagerness to disparage and slander those upholding the law, and only those LEOs working under Trump's administration policies...because embracing grace in Dan's small mind evidently is best manifested in hateful rhetoric and behavior.
"Created an atmosphere of fear and terror - ie, literally terrorism - by his racist profiling to stop and pick up and abduct/disappear people for being Latino or looking foreign. THAT is oppression."
And the lying never stops with Dan. The "atmosphere of fear and terror - ie, literally terrorism" was created by Joe Biden and Tim Walz by their invitation to criminals from afar, who raped and murdered (among other things), which resulted in our wonderful president acting to fulfill his campaign promised to secure the border and expel those without legal right to be here, which subsequently was purposely framed as a nazi-like policy, because to the Democrats/lefties/marxists/progressives (same things), law and order screams NAZI! Dan further lies that it is only skin color compelling Trump's actions rather than the illegality of the presence of an individual regardless of the person's race or place of origin. However as has been mentioned, it is rational for ICE to include considering the appearance of an individual among other criteria for detaining that individual. So, Dan lies in saying it's "racist" profiling instead of "racial" profiling, which is not in any way an immoral policy in law enforcement. It's just that the grace embracing need it to be in order to better besmirch the character of better people doing their duty under the law.
That's not all of Dan's lying in this particular point (as there are multiple lies in almost every one of them). He again lies by using the terms "abduct" and "disappear people", which implies a legal obligation to inform anyone upon taking into custody a suspect guilty of a crime. For citizens, they have the right to a phone call in most jurisdictions, I don't know if any federal law connected to immigration and border enforcement provides for that. In any case, those terms are willfully inflaming for the specific intention of disparaging law enforcement by grace embracing fake Christians and other marxists.
I can say that I’ve see no indication of the fear and terror, beyond white, liberal, women talking about other people in fear and terror.
"Repeatedly blocked and attacked efforts to release files related to sexual predators and pedophiles. THAT is oppression."
Trump has called for the release of the Epstein files since his campaign and throughout his first year in office. There is no evidence of any kind that he did the slightest thing to block that effort in any way. None. Dan simply likes to lie about Trump because...you know...embrace grace. He also continues to use the word "pedophile" so as to inflame more hatred from other useful idiots of Dan's kind, knowing that even in the files, there's been nothing mentioned regarding prepubescent children. But Dan and those grace embracers like him need to make Trump appear as evil as possible to stoke more fear and outrage in more sheep like Dan who only listen to their own demons who rule them, rather than facts presented to them. That's truly perverted of Dan to continue lying in this manner.
"Demonized LGBTQ folks. THAT is oppression - something that Muslim extremists, Christian extremists and Nazis all have in common."
More lies. As Craig has said, Trump has been the most "gay" friendly GOP president yet (to his shame). There's no need to be particularly friendly to them such that one seeks to be known as a "gay" friendly president. But, worse than that, Dan again lies in again grouping in with muslims and nazis "Christian extremists". No LGBTQ person has ever had to fear a truly extremist Christian, because nothing in the faith compels an adherent to act in a manner threatening to anyone, beyond reminding people of the consequences of rejecting the Will of God...which is an act about which Dan clearly gives no concern given his own perversions.
"Attacked and demonized the free press. THAT is oppression and part of the path of authoritarians."
You've been corrected and enlightened on this routine lie of yours every time you've regurgitated it. Trump justly calls out the leftist media who lies about him as you do. At the same time, with rare exceptions, he continues to respond to their questions in press conferences without fear or stalling, as has been the case with Dem presidents, particularly the inept Biden that Dan laughably described as a better man and more fit for the presidency than Trump...which was never true in Biden's entire political career. A far more worthy target of such grace embracing vitriol and hate should have been Dan's Barry O'Bumble:
https://www.cato.org/commentary/barack-obamas-war-free-press#
Now THERE was some actual oppression against a free press. Note where it states:
"A coalition of 50 news organizations, including ABS, CNN, the New York Times, the Washington Post (real news sources according to Dan)...submitted a letter of protest to Attorney General Eric Holder about the raid."
This refers to their oppressive attacks on the free press.
" Literally committed extrajudicial executions of people in international waters. No jury. No trial. No chance to surrender. NO PROOF that they were actually drug dealers AND EVEN IF THEY WERE (doubtful), that is not a capitol offense. THAT is oppression."
This lie has been addressed as well, and as always, when Dan's corrected, even with supportive evidence which directly contrasts the narrative he falsely perpetuates...such as remains true with the Access Hollywood tapes..., Dan continues to lie as if the facts were never presented to him or that there's some legitimate reason to doubt the source of those facts. It's typical Dan. Typical Dan "embrace grace" bullshit. Dan's a liar and by virtue of the definition he himself produced, he's clearly a pervert and indeed a far worse pervert than he pretends Trump is.
Again, it's not like I'm throwing out a silly little whimsical opinion unique to me when I note the reality of this administration's descent into authoritarianism. Multiple scholars, historians, experts and regular people - liberal and conservative - are noting the observable traits, trends and practices of authoritarians that this administration is embracing (and which is being ignored by the useful idiots willing to turn a blind eye).
A survey of
more than 500 political scientists finds that the vast majority
think the United States is moving swiftly from liberal democracy toward some form of authoritarianism.
[from an article WAY back in April of last year, before the worst of the descent into authoritarian practices fully developed.]
https://www.npr.org/2025/04/22/nx-s1-5340753/trump-democracy-authoritarianism-competive-survey-political-scientist
“I have seen this brand of strongman megalomania and the adverse effects it can ultimately have on leaders and their governments,” wrote Ben-Ghiat, the author of “Strongmen: Mussolini to the Present.”
https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/authoritarianism-expert-says-donald-trump-110415476.html
The United States is “on a trajectory” toward authoritarian rule, according to a sobering new intelligence-style assessment
by former US intelligence and national security officials
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/oct/16/trump-authoritarianism-warning
David Frum—political commentator, former speechwriter for President George W. Bush, and senior editor at The Atlantic—spoke about the real-world consequences of authoritarian-style governance. Moving beyond rhetoric, Frum outlined how economic policies, immigration crackdowns, attacks on science, and distortions of history carry heavy costs for Americans and weaken democratic society.
https://www.jewsunitedfordemocracy.org/blog/the-high-costs-of-authoritarianism-david-frum-on-trumps-policies-at-home-and-abroad/
Levitsky... recently co-authored an article in Foreign Affairs arguing that the United States has entered a phase of “competitive authoritarianism,” in which a leader who is democratically elected acts undemocratically once in office—they might punish critics, remove civil servants, and abuse power to shift the electoral field in their favor. It’s neither full democracy nor full authoritarianism.
https://www.hks.harvard.edu/faculty-research/policy-topics/democracy-governance/democracy-2025-harvard-professors-rising
https://www.americanprogress.org/article/a-green-light-for-authoritarianism-how-the-trump-administration-fuels-global-autocracy/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10224651/
https://www.lpm.org/news/2026-02-16/concerns-over-autocracy-in-the-u-s-continue-to-grow
I could go on and on. This is not a minority position in scholarly, expert, educated opinions, and that includes conservative experts. But you all will continue to turn your heads, remain silent and ignore it, as they come for the Jews, for the Union-members, for the LGBTQ... until there's no one to speak up for you.
At the very least, can you be open-minded enough to agree
Yes, there are MANY people
Regular people and experts
Liberal, moderate and conservative
Who are genuinely concerned about what they genuinely believe are autocratic, or authoritarian, or fascist traits displayed by this administration...?
Can you recognize the reality that this is not some random, outlier view?
If so, can you at least see A BIT why so many people are concerned, and that it's not TDS (which, itself, is not a real thing?)
Dan
I’m happy to acknowledge that people believe all sorts of stuff that may or not be True. People believed Pizzagate, the Steele dossier, and that the Epstein files would take Trump down, none of those things are True.
Trump is uniquely polarizing. There’s a subset of conservatives who don’t like him, along with a bunch of those on the left.
If Trump was what y’all say he is, then it’d be incredibly obvious. But the MSM still MSMs, protesters still protest, he’s even negotiated a compromise to dial things back here in the People’s Republic.
Ultimately the problem is that there is a continuing litany of bad things about Trump and they end up being false or decades old and exaggerated.
But you cling to your narrative if it helps.
It would help if the last two DFL presidents hadn’t done things that were identical or worse than Trump yet you didn’t spew the same hysterical blather.
Dan can cite all the lefty and NeverTrumper sources he likes, but he fails to provide any evidence of authoritarianism in this presidency. Cutting the crap and enforcing long established laws ignored by the Dems simply because they conflict with their marxist agenda doesn't constitute authoritarianism. It's called "a president doing his constitutionally mandated job".
But Dan's embrace of grace requires lying and perversions.
Obviously Dan isn't going to cite anything that doesn't fit his narrative. I'd be shocked if the "conservatives" he speaks of are not all the remains of the neocon movement, a movement he reviled for years. As I said, Trump is polarizing and he's managed to piss off some conservatives, who then become tools for Dan and his ilk. What Dan ignores is the polling data and election results that show traditional DFL voters trending toward Trump.
My problem with Dan's whole thing is that it is virtually impossible to make these sorts of judgements in the moment. Partly this is because the rhetoric from the left is loud, but not necessarily accurate. People hear and respond reflexively to noise, without digging deeper.
If I remember, Lincoln and Truman weren't particularly popular during their terms either.
It's making a permanent judgement based on temporary circumstances. I suspect that P-BO's reputation will suffer as time goes on and we see the full impact of his presidency, as will Biden's.
Marshal...
Dan can cite all the lefty and NeverTrumper sources he likes, but he fails to provide any evidence of authoritarianism in this presidency.
You see, no matter how many experts, scholars, historians... no matter how much evidence... no matter that this shift into authoritarianism is evident to people across the political spectrum, including some of the Felon's own former advisors and allies, NONE of that matters to the "true believers..." the useful idiots. Your collective refusal to recognize the evidence that is apparent to most (? A huge number, at any rate) experts and regular observers is yet another bit of evidence testifying to the authoritarianism... authoritarians historically have been facile in duping their followers. You're living in an alternate, non-factual, anti-expert fog of emotionally-driven fear and loathing.
YOU are the evidence of authoritarianism.
"From 2017 to 2019, John Kelly served as Chief of Staff for President Donald Trump, with his two-year tenure making him Trump’s longest-serving chief of staff to-date. During the 2024 election campaign, however, this one-time Trump aid warned voters about reelecting him, calling him “certainly an authoritarian.”...
The MAGA agenda seeks to uphold the status quo of white patriarchy and to do that, it calls for a return to conservative values that privilege men in the gender hierarchy and the explicit exclusion of those who do not fit into the racial hierarchy that privileges whiteness."
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/usappblog/2025/06/09/trump-fits-the-bill-of-an-authoritarian-but-so-do-many-americans/
https://www.populismstudies.org/professor-cain-trump-is-playing-the-classical-authoritarian-game/
You can say whatever you want to about the "experts" you appoint. The problem I have with this nonsense, is that I can find other "experts" that disagree with you and you'll simply dismiss those experts.
It's bizarre that you give disgruntled ex staffers so much weight without any clue as to what their motivation might be.
The "white patriarchy" stuff is simply BS. How many of these sources fit your definition of "real journalists" or have done "peer reviewed" studies.
You mistake opinions that agree with you (coming from people who's politics you'd demonize in a heartbeat) for expertise.
Given how screwed up Europe is right now, and the well known academic bias to the left, I just can't take what a Euro professor says seriously.
Maybe he should be more focused on the data regarding how left wing policies are working in Europe. FYI, the UK is engaging in significantly more "authoritarian" policies (jailing people for what they say), than anything Trump is doing.
Former Trump allies, aides and longtime conservatives who have referred to him as leaning towards fascism or authoritarianism or otherwise unfit for office... a VERY short and incomplete list...
John Kelly
Mark Milley
Steve Bannon
Liz Cheney
Dick Cheney
Mike Pence
John Bolton
Mark Esper
Bill Barr
James Mattis
HR McMaster
Rex Tillerson
Elizabeth Neumann
Sarah Matthew
Miles Taylor
...
Etc, etc, etc
But it's easier to dismiss these loyal conservatives, along with the large numbers of historians who call him one of the bottom five worst presidents, along with the scientists who reject his harmful and ignorant approach to opposing science, data and research, along with the hundreds of scholars who warn against his authoritarianism, etc, etc.
I get that it's easier to tell yourself that this is just a widespread conspiracy against this president.
But you sound delusional when you do that.
There IS a Trump Derangement Syndrome, but it doesn't mean what you think it is.
Just ask the true believers who followed Jim Jones.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/steveforbes/2025/09/09/people-are-being-thrown-in-uk-prisons-over-what-theyve-said-online-can-free-speech-be-saved/
standingforfreedom.com/2024/08/16/think-before-you-post-the-u-k-is-now-jailing-people-for-social-media-comments/
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/09/03/the-victims-of-britains-free-speech-crackdown/
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cr548zdmz3jo
https://factually.co/fact-checks/law-enforcement/uk-arrests-for-social-media-posts-f2aa61
This is obviously one example, but I would certainly argue that jailing or punishing people for expressing their opinions seems pretty authoritarian.
I could be wrong but the UN placing one of the most authoritarian and repressive regimes on earth in a leadership role on a commission intended to encourage non oppressive/authoritarian actions seems like rewarding the very behavior you bitch about.
You do realize that when Trump doesn't run for a third term, and hands over the presidency to whoever wins, that your whole "Trump is an authoritarian" narrative will be proven wrong don't you?
What part of "Trump is polarizing" do you not understand? The very fact that these people are free to speak their minds about Trump simply reinforces the notion that he's not "authoritarian".
I'm not "dismissing" anything (that's your thing). I'm pointing out the reality that there are disgruntled former Trump and "conservative/neocon" folks who don't like Trump for any number of reasons. The GOP/conservative movement tends to be more open to this kind of disagreement.
As noted, multiple times, making these kinds of absolute claims in the midst of a presidency is stupid and short sighted.
Also as noted, Lincoln had many who disparaged the job he did during his terms, and the DFL actively opposed Truman on multiple issues.
The existence of disagreement, and it's public expression, undercuts your hysterical ranting.
Craig:
As noted, multiple times, making these kinds of absolute claims in the midst of a presidency is stupid and short sighted.
I know you've "noted" that. Fascists and authoritarians depend upon that trait in those who will become their useful idiots. But that you "noted" it, doesn't mean that rational adults can't see it in real time. As I have noted, MANY experts, scholars and normal (but informed) people across the political spectrum are seeing it.
Do you truly think that the German people were incapable of seeing the tyrannical direction the Hitler administration was heading to earlier rather than later?
Come, now.
Craig:
I'm pointing out the reality that there are disgruntled former Trump and "conservative/neocon" folks who don't like Trump for any number of reasons.
There is a distinct difference between having reasonable disagreements about, "Is this policy or that policy the best thing?" or "I wish he weren't so arrogant..." THIS is not THAT. The tens of thousands of former allies, conservatives, scholars, experts are not having a polite disagreement. We are genuinely recognizing the warning signs of fascism.
You confuse "oh, gee... I wish he weren't so angry" with "THESE are traits we have long seen in nations that have moved into fascism/authoritarianism."
As to your earlier comment about you finding scholars who would disagree with the suggestion,
1. I bet you can't.
2. I'm noting quite clearly the existence of scholars and experts across the political spectrum who are saying we are heading towards or have already entered a realm of authoritarianism. While you MIGHT be able to find a less-respected conservative loyalist who will affirm "No, this is not a descent into authoritarianism" you will not find a progressive minded expert who will say that.
3. The presence of across-the-spectrum alarms being raised is one of the signs of reasonable concern. It's literally peer-reviewed.
As has been said when people ask if you believe in ...X?
"Believe in it!? I've seen it!"
Signs of authoritarianism:
* Politicizing public institutions
* Spreading disinformation
* Aggrandizing executive power
* Quashing descent
* Scapegoating vulnerable communities
* Corrupting elections
* Stoking violence
https://protectdemocracy.org/work/the-authoritarian-playbook/
And I know you'll likely say, "Nu-uh, YOU all do that!" but no, that's not reality. And I know you and those in your silos may THINK that's reality (y'all have been whining for years about the non-existent "war on Christmas" and how "everyone tells white men how bad they are!" etc, etc), but it's just not. That, too, is one of the warning signs of fascism - when the "true believers" of the authoritarian regime can't see anything differently than what they've been told by their conman bosses.
Or, here's another source/list:
* A system that is willing to engage in a spectrum of undemocratic practice from corruption and sowing lies and conspiracy theories, to using fear and violence in order to manipulate, divide people, and maintain power.
* The misuse of the power of the state to advance the personal and/or partisan desires of the head of state or a ruling clique (e.g., persecuting political opponents, subverting honest elections).
* Often emerges “legally”, by democratically elected leaders who subvert democratic norms and institutions to stay in power.
* A slow and quiet advance over a period of years where small battles weaken the foundations of democracy, which can culminate in a period of rapid democratic losses and decline.
* Rejecting democratic rules of game.
* Denying the legitimacy of opponents.
* Tolerating or encouraging political violence.
* Curtailing the civil liberties of opponents.
* Breaking down social cohesion to divide and rule a society.
https://commonslibrary.org/authoritarianism-how-you-know-it-when-you-see-it/
We know it's happening because we can observe it happening. IF you're not blindly partisan.
Yes, I completely think that after Weimar that the German people wanted exactly what Hitler was telling them. They probably didn't want all of it, but they wanted someone to avenge the humiliation of the Treaty of Versailles.
"tens of thousands", really? Exaggerate much? By all means prove your claims. Of course feel free to take what I actually said and twist it however you'd like.
1. I don't have time right now, but I'll see what I can find. I'll note that you've arbitrarily limited me to "scholars". Given that 80+% of "scholars" are left wing, I'm not surprised you'll stack the deck.
2. I'll note that you assume, without proof, that anyone I will find will be "less respected".
"Less respected" by whom?
Define "less respected"?
Why are "progressive minded experts" the only options?
3. What in the hell are you talking about? Do you know how screwed up the "peer review" "process" has become over the lest few years?
Given the fact that you've put arbitrary restrictions on what you'll accept, I'll note that I predicted this when I made the comment.
So, absent a level playing field and no restrictions, I see no reason to waste my time finding material for you to summarily dismiss.
To further demonstrate what an authoritarian and villainous organization looks like, just look to this administration's latest scam - the "board of 'peace...'"
https://throughthesewoods.blogspot.com/2026/02/the-board-of-peace.html
How gullible are you all?
Oh, by the way, this "board" that has been created ostensibly for the benefit of the Palestinians in Gaza... You want to guess how many Palestinians are on the board to oversee this rebuilding?
At some point, it's no longer gullibility. It's just complicity in ripping us ALL off (to the tune of $10 billion, at least initially) You fine with writing that check to your billionaire to help make him even richer?
THIS. This "board of peace" is what authoritarians do. Open your eyes.
Signs of authoritarianism:
* Politicizing public institutions: Biden.
* Spreading disinformation: Biden, Walz, Clinton, Walz, Frey, P-BO, the MSM, to name a few that aren't Trump.
* Aggrandizing executive power: This makes no sense. Is your argument that POTUS must abrogate and refuse to exercise the executive powers granted by the constitution? Or merely that folx like you get to impose arbitrary restrictions of presidents they don't agree with?
* Quashing descent: Biden, Meta, MSM,
* Scapegoating vulnerable communities: Biden, Meta, MSM (as this has virtually zero objective meaning, I'll choose to do as you do and apply it however I want). I guess that you don't consider the victims of crimes committed by illegal aliens and those harmed by drug and human trafficking vulnerable enough to even mention.
* Corrupting elections: Have you not been following the news out of GA? But, by all means, prove this claim.
* Stoking violence: I'll see if I can find the video of DFL national leaders calling for violence for you. I guess every riot since 2014 just magically appeared without stoking, right?
I've been documenting examples of the DFL/ASPL/AWFLs doing virtually all of these things in the past decade or so. Not to mention censorship, forcing people to buy something they might not have wanted, and threats of firing for those who didn't comply.
But you keep pretending. It's cute when you actually do the things you accuse me of doing.
But, by all means, provide specific examples of your second group.
Coming from someone who's blindly partisan, you make me laugh.
Desperation isn't a good look for you.
I don't particularly trust any politicians, regardless of party.
Don't know, don't care. I'd suspect that the new "Palestinian" constitution, and the Hamas refusal to disarm and stop calling for the removal of Israel might play a role. Why would you put people who keep engaging in acts of war on a peace board?
We're up to about 3 times that in fraud just in Minnesota, with estimates of more than that in CA and NY, so your guesses about potential future fraud don't seem particularly worthy of concern. FYI, the freaking MN state government including the idiot you just voted for facilitated or ignored the fraud and the Secretary of State is on tape taking bribes.
But you keep fantasizing.
What’s different about the two of us as regards this way off topic diversion of yours, is that I have and can provide specific examples for virtually every single one of your markers. And all of those examples are either from democrat US leaders, or countries in Europe with progressive governments. I don’t need made up might happen whatever I can and have cited reality.
https://youtu.be/aj1Rwlztapg?si=gy9-kXnYh6ZDB3Yt
https://youtu.be/aj1Rwlztapg?si=41F9min7YGDPw1b6
https://youtu.be/aj1Rwlztapg?si=41F9min7YGDPw1b6
“While the vast majority of scholars surveyed say Trump is pushing the country toward autocracy, other professors strongly disagree. James Campbell, a retired political scientist at the University at Buffalo, SUNY, says Trump is using legitimate presidential powers to address long-standing problems. Campbell points to Trump's use of tariffs to try to push companies to bring manufacturing jobs back to the United States. In recent decades, economic globalization led to catastrophic layoffs of everyone from furniture makers in North Carolina to auto assembly-line workers in the Midwest as firms sent work overseas, especially to China.”
From an NPR article.
"no matter how much evidence"
WHAT "evidence", pervert? I don't see "evidence" anywhere in your comments. Lots of accusations...lots of grace embracing name calling. No evidence, though.
"Experts, scholars, historians"?? You tried this crap with your presidential rankings, and that was just a load of leftist, NeverTrumper crapola, with not one "ranking" based on presidential policies and their consequences. You cite "experts, scholars, and historians" who simply hate Trump in the same irrational way you do and pretend because they're so-called "experts, scholars and historians", that makes their evidence-free opinions valid and credible. You're a sorry excuse for a human being. And you're clearly no Christian.
I don't care how many "loyal conservatives" you think you can cite. If they're not bringing evidence or examples of authoritarianism that surpasses that of Obama and Biden, you're just jerking off.
When Dan is citing John Bolton as some paragon of conservatism you know he's unhinged.
You are correct that the dearth of specific examples that conform to his ever changing list is deficient. Especially given the few examples I've pointed out that were carried out by Biden/P-BO.
Now "opinion polls" are "evidence". This is good news. The next time Dan demands "objective proof" we can give him opinions and hunches.
Note, Dan and his anonymous "experts" aren't really saying Thrum IS an "authoritarian" they're saying (without specific examples, and through anti_Trump bias) that he is "trending" toward "authoritarianism". Which means that when he passes the torch to another candidate, that they'll be wrong.
1. Authoritarian leadership is not binary, there are degrees.
2. You could probably call Millei or Bulele authoritarian, yet both have done amazingly positive things.
3. If enforcing immigration laws makes Trump authoritarian, the every POTUS back to Bush 1, was authoritarian.
4. If using executive power to implement policies is authoritarian, then Biden’s refusal to enforce immigration laws would seem to make him authoritarian as well.
5. The office of POTUS carries with it a significant amount of constitutional authority. Using that authority is not authoritarian.
The autocorrect for Biden’s is bidets.
"people across the political spectrum are seeing it."
No, they're not, or you could produce examples of what they're seeing. A liar like John Kelly or Liz Cheney can say anything, but that doesn't mean they're actually seeing what they say they see. Where's the "OBJECTIVE PROOF"? We're already well aware of their opposition to Trump.
How does defining a word stand as evidence of your accusation?
It doesn’t. You just have to believe Dan without seeing proof.
https://cdn.mrc.org/static/pdfuploads/BidenCensorshipInitiatives_Report_FINAL_DIGITAL+%281%29.pdf-1741964285292.pdf
Can you say, "authoritarian"?
Projection is embracing grace.
Art,
I knew you'd bring the detail.
Trump is the only president who's done anything to release the Epstein docs, and so far all they've proven is that Trump cut ties early and called the cops on Epstein.
Again, Trump has been the GOP president most supportive of gays. Strangely enough the LBs might actually be swinging back to the GOP because of the DFL obsession with the TQ+.
Calling out the "mistakes", and false reporting of the MSM is not hatred or demonizing them. It's pushing for the Truth. Given the fact that Trump has already doe more press interactions than Biden, this seems a bizarre claim. How hard would it be for Trump to shut the MSM out entirely? Yet he chooses to be extraordinarily available to the press.
Every one of Dan's points has been addressed multiple times, and Dan pretends as though this hasn't happened. Further, Dan refuses to provide specifics or deal with the specific examples in DFL administrations.
This isn't trying to justify Trump's actions with "the other guys did is", it is pointing out the massive hypocrisy in demonizing Trump for things that P-BO, Biden, and Clinton weren't demonized for.
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