Apparently Trump just announced support for a $10k tax credit for families that home school. This seems like an excellent idea.
10 comments:
Anonymous
said...
I thought you were opposed to vote buying... but I guess it's only vote buying when poorer, struggling people receive government investments, not when white conservative Christians get support?
1. As y'all seem to like to use "the other guy does it" regularly, I guess that it shouldn't be a problem if I do the same.
2. I'm agreeing with this because I think it makes good policy sense.
3. It's likely that those who'd qualify for this would vote for Trump anyway, so I'm not sure it qualifies as vote buying if you've already got those votes.
4. Are you now saying that you are against vote buying?
5. At this point, all trump has done is express support for a proposal. Unlike Biden who repeatedly promised that he'd buy votes with his scheme to transfer responsibility for student loans to the taxpayers. Further, also unlike Biden, this proposal doesn't go against any recent SCOTUS decisions.
6. I think that giving parents (possibly with income restrictions) some sort of tax incentive to offset the costs of home school or private school is a good idea. Hell, look at how many rich democrats and DFL politicians push the masses into public school, while sheltering their own kids in exclusive private schools.
7. So you approve of Biden buying votes (even to the extent of pretending like his promises are reality no matter if he follows through or not), but not of anyone else buying votes?
Damn! While I still go through the last half of 2020, we have here unmitigated support for a Trump proposal! Way cool! (I'll add it in time!)
In the meantime, this simply can manifest in some sort of refund for tax money spent on schools by parents teaching their kids themselves. How could anyone have a problem with that? Is tax money for the schools or the kids who are supposed to be educated because of them? If they're to educate the kids, then giving home schooling parents their money back is just and fair. I could almost swear I've heard Dan speak of justice one or twice.
One could quibble over how much the credit is, trying to match it by the average amount of tax money said to go toward each student. If it's only, say $7000, that would be fine.
It's not strange at all when I support a policy that Trump supports to see me support that policy. Now, a little research leads me to find that he supported a similar policy at the end of his term, which went nowhere.
So while I wholeheartedly agree with the policy, I very much want to see something beyond simply support if he's elected.
It looks like it's a proposal to allow funds in a 529 to be used for home/private school. Which I do agree with, but note that it doesn't help those who need it the most.
That would be a different issue, I'd say. But this one would, could and certainly should pressure the public indoctrination centers to amend their evil modern progressive ways and return to the business of educating America's kids.
As to support, I'll note that with only a half year left of his first term to review, I've not found anything which matches this overt expression of support for one of his policies or proposals after being told you do that sort of thing. Just saying'. I know I've only been reviewing one forum in which this level of support had been expressed, but given the types of topics you cover here, it's somewhat surprising the dearth of such expressions. Again, I'll not be likely to seek out more on platforms such as Facebook or Twitter, but if you stumble on any such examples from those or other such places, I'd be keen to look at them.
The fact that this plan, while good, wouldn't help poor parents who's children are the one's who have the most to gain be being freed from their dependence on public schools IS the issue. I'd argue that the few parents who have enough inn their 529 accounts to pull money out for private/home school expenses could likely already afford those things.
Don't misunderstand me, I completely agree that this is a good idea and a worthy (if small) first step toward freeing children from public schools.
I'm sure you'll interpret your subjective review as worthy of extrapolating to the point where you'll tout some broad, generalized, conclusion about everything I've ever said. FYI, if you go back further, you'll see that I rarely post much about actions of GOP presidents that I agree with. I expect GOP/conservative presidents to do things I agree with, it's why I vote for them. Me posting about things I agree with presidents I voted for would be a very boring and pointless exercise. As a rule I post about things that DFL presidents do that I agree with, and things that GOP presidents do that I don't agree with. The reason I do this is because both of those two things should be rare and worth writing about.
I agree with Trump/Bush/Bush/Reagan/Eisenhower about X,Y or Z isn't noteworthy, why would I write about it?
This post is noteworthy because it is a, rare, example of Trump speaking on an issue that isn't up front and that is often ignored.
"The fact that this plan, while good, wouldn't help poor parents who's children are the one's who have the most to gain be being freed from their dependence on public schools IS the issue."
If this goes through, it could be some degree of incentive for public indoctrination centers to go back to actually educating kids in that which will actually benefit them...the basic "reading' 'riting and 'rithmetic". Sadly, though. Some of those who need it most aren't those who want to learn, and haven't parents who give a damn. Thus, a different issue, and one which is worthy of attention given the benefit to society to have well educated kids across the board.
I don't believe any of these things.. homeschooling, charter schools, parochial schools...will put an end to public schools, though that would be nice if all those other options actually result in well educated kids ready to enter the world as productive, law-abiding adults. Long before public schools were a thing, many brilliant people were educated in any of a variety of ways in a variety of disciplines. But that was a different era and I think if we can get public schools to reform, they'll again be of beneficial service to society and its culture. Trump's proposal is but a baby step and if I'm not mistaken, it's simply to allow parents who homeschool relief from taxes ostensibly used to support public schools. After all, why should they have to pay.
Similar proposals have been put forth for those who pay tuition at private and parochial schools, who then are actually paying twice...to support both the school of their choosing while still paying for the crappy public schools they don't want their kids attending. This sounds like that.
Posting about GOP actions you like is not at all boring, and it's a good thing to highlight good things they do. Those good things need to be explained so that others understand why they're actually good things. The more people are aware of good things a president or party does, the more likely they will support them. The more who support them means it's more likely we'll enjoy effective leadership and legislation. Between the two of us, we've given some measure of explanation for why this proposal of Trump's would be a good thing. To simply say he's doing it isn't enough, especially for his detractors, or those who are influenced by hearing only from his detractors.
Neither of us have a huge following. I don't post with that in mind, but on the potential some might read and either be persuaded by my words or provide a persuasive argument which will benefit me to hear. It's good to present examples of good deeds of presidents or parties supported so that others understand that support and possibly come around to supporting them, too. It isn't any harder than posting on any of the other things on which you do post, and likely of no less benefit.
There have been lists of things Trump's done as president. I'm not down with absolutely all of them, but imagine if more people saw those lists...like you for example. Or more especially, someone like Dan, who would then have to argue why any of them were bad ideas or be forced to accept he backed the wrong liar. (That was a joke. Trump's not a liar in any way which should detract from his benefit to America)
"If this goes through, it could be some degree of incentive for public indoctrination centers to go back to actually educating kids in that which will actually benefit them...the basic "reading' 'riting and 'rithmetic"."
While this is a theoretical possibility, the rot in the education system is deep and I suspect it'll take more than this to fix.
" Trump's proposal is but a baby step and if I'm not mistaken, it's simply to allow parents who homeschool relief from taxes ostensibly used to support public schools."
1. I'm not sure if this is Trump's proposal or someone else's that he supports. 2. The proposal I saw was to allow 529 savings accounts to be used for private or home school expenses. Not for tax relief. 3. I guess it'd be possible to do some sort of federal tax relief to offset the local school taxes, but I haven't seen a proposal to do so. 4. A tax credit would be, IMO, a much more effective and wide ranging tool than the 529 thing.
"While this is a theoretical possibility, the rot in the education system is deep and I suspect it'll take more than this to fix."
No doubt. There's no rational way to disagree with that at all.
"1. I'm not sure if this is Trump's proposal or someone else's that he supports."
Doesn't matter. It's good he's on board with it.
"2. The proposal I saw was to allow 529 savings accounts to be used for private or home school expenses. Not for tax relief."
Well, there are tax savings having such accounts, but I did stray from the point. My bad. yet those tax advantages can be regarded as some degree of reimbursement of education related taxes.
"3. I guess it'd be possible to do some sort of federal tax relief to offset the local school taxes, but I haven't seen a proposal to do so."
I don't know if there's been any formal proposals to allow tax relief for those who home school or send their kids to private/parochial schools, but the subject has been discussed for sure. My widowed mother sent four out of five kids to Catholic school for six years apiece. She certainly could have used the relief.
" 4. A tax credit would be, IMO, a much more effective and wide ranging tool than the 529 thing."
Absolutely. It does make the playing field between public schools and alternatives more even. More people would take advantage of those alternatives, which would decrease the money going to public schools since student population determines how much they routinely receive (which is why they were so pissed when I ditched).
1. Well, if your claim that this was a "Trump proposal" is inaccurate, I could see why you'd say that it "doesn't matter". I agree that this is a good idea regardless of Trump's support. But you made the claim that it was a "Trump proposal", while I see no indication of that.
2. You can play semantic games all you want. The reality is that the proposal I saw and wrote about, while a good idea, will not help those who need it most. They could be regarded as anything. But they are not a direct offset of school taxes. They also only benefit those with enough income to fund them to a level that would allow large dispersals prior to college AND allow enough to still pay for college.
3. I'm not arguing that relief isn't needed. I'm arguing that this particular proposal wouldn't help the low income families that can benefit the most from getting out of the public schools. There have been some local efforts to allow property tax $$ to go with students, but I'm not aware of anything currently being discussed on a national level.
Although Trump could go a long way toward solidifying his increased AA support by proposing such a measure.
4. That was, is, and has been my point all along. The 529 thing is good, but it's not a broad based proposal.
10 comments:
I thought you were opposed to vote buying... but I guess it's only vote buying when poorer, struggling people receive government investments, not when white conservative Christians get support?
Dan
1. As y'all seem to like to use "the other guy does it" regularly, I guess that it shouldn't be a problem if I do the same.
2. I'm agreeing with this because I think it makes good policy sense.
3. It's likely that those who'd qualify for this would vote for Trump anyway, so I'm not sure it qualifies as vote buying if you've already got those votes.
4. Are you now saying that you are against vote buying?
5. At this point, all trump has done is express support for a proposal. Unlike Biden who repeatedly promised that he'd buy votes with his scheme to transfer responsibility for student loans to the taxpayers. Further, also unlike Biden, this proposal doesn't go against any recent SCOTUS decisions.
6. I think that giving parents (possibly with income restrictions) some sort of tax incentive to offset the costs of home school or private school is a good idea. Hell, look at how many rich democrats and DFL politicians push the masses into public school, while sheltering their own kids in exclusive private schools.
7. So you approve of Biden buying votes (even to the extent of pretending like his promises are reality no matter if he follows through or not), but not of anyone else buying votes?
8. Goose/gander...
Damn! While I still go through the last half of 2020, we have here unmitigated support for a Trump proposal! Way cool! (I'll add it in time!)
In the meantime, this simply can manifest in some sort of refund for tax money spent on schools by parents teaching their kids themselves. How could anyone have a problem with that? Is tax money for the schools or the kids who are supposed to be educated because of them? If they're to educate the kids, then giving home schooling parents their money back is just and fair. I could almost swear I've heard Dan speak of justice one or twice.
One could quibble over how much the credit is, trying to match it by the average amount of tax money said to go toward each student. If it's only, say $7000, that would be fine.
It's not strange at all when I support a policy that Trump supports to see me support that policy. Now, a little research leads me to find that he supported a similar policy at the end of his term, which went nowhere.
So while I wholeheartedly agree with the policy, I very much want to see something beyond simply support if he's elected.
It looks like it's a proposal to allow funds in a 529 to be used for home/private school. Which I do agree with, but note that it doesn't help those who need it the most.
That would be a different issue, I'd say. But this one would, could and certainly should pressure the public indoctrination centers to amend their evil modern progressive ways and return to the business of educating America's kids.
As to support, I'll note that with only a half year left of his first term to review, I've not found anything which matches this overt expression of support for one of his policies or proposals after being told you do that sort of thing. Just saying'. I know I've only been reviewing one forum in which this level of support had been expressed, but given the types of topics you cover here, it's somewhat surprising the dearth of such expressions. Again, I'll not be likely to seek out more on platforms such as Facebook or Twitter, but if you stumble on any such examples from those or other such places, I'd be keen to look at them.
What would be a different issue?
The fact that this plan, while good, wouldn't help poor parents who's children are the one's who have the most to gain be being freed from their dependence on public schools IS the issue. I'd argue that the few parents who have enough inn their 529 accounts to pull money out for private/home school expenses could likely already afford those things.
Don't misunderstand me, I completely agree that this is a good idea and a worthy (if small) first step toward freeing children from public schools.
I'm sure you'll interpret your subjective review as worthy of extrapolating to the point where you'll tout some broad, generalized, conclusion about everything I've ever said. FYI, if you go back further, you'll see that I rarely post much about actions of GOP presidents that I agree with. I expect GOP/conservative presidents to do things I agree with, it's why I vote for them. Me posting about things I agree with presidents I voted for would be a very boring and pointless exercise. As a rule I post about things that DFL presidents do that I agree with, and things that GOP presidents do that I don't agree with. The reason I do this is because both of those two things should be rare and worth writing about.
I agree with Trump/Bush/Bush/Reagan/Eisenhower about X,Y or Z isn't noteworthy, why would I write about it?
This post is noteworthy because it is a, rare, example of Trump speaking on an issue that isn't up front and that is often ignored.
"What would be a different issue?"
Those who need help most.
"The fact that this plan, while good, wouldn't help poor parents who's children are the one's who have the most to gain be being freed from their dependence on public schools IS the issue."
If this goes through, it could be some degree of incentive for public indoctrination centers to go back to actually educating kids in that which will actually benefit them...the basic "reading' 'riting and 'rithmetic". Sadly, though. Some of those who need it most aren't those who want to learn, and haven't parents who give a damn. Thus, a different issue, and one which is worthy of attention given the benefit to society to have well educated kids across the board.
I don't believe any of these things.. homeschooling, charter schools, parochial schools...will put an end to public schools, though that would be nice if all those other options actually result in well educated kids ready to enter the world as productive, law-abiding adults. Long before public schools were a thing, many brilliant people were educated in any of a variety of ways in a variety of disciplines. But that was a different era and I think if we can get public schools to reform, they'll again be of beneficial service to society and its culture. Trump's proposal is but a baby step and if I'm not mistaken, it's simply to allow parents who homeschool relief from taxes ostensibly used to support public schools. After all, why should they have to pay.
Similar proposals have been put forth for those who pay tuition at private and parochial schools, who then are actually paying twice...to support both the school of their choosing while still paying for the crappy public schools they don't want their kids attending. This sounds like that.
Posting about GOP actions you like is not at all boring, and it's a good thing to highlight good things they do. Those good things need to be explained so that others understand why they're actually good things. The more people are aware of good things a president or party does, the more likely they will support them. The more who support them means it's more likely we'll enjoy effective leadership and legislation. Between the two of us, we've given some measure of explanation for why this proposal of Trump's would be a good thing. To simply say he's doing it isn't enough, especially for his detractors, or those who are influenced by hearing only from his detractors.
Neither of us have a huge following. I don't post with that in mind, but on the potential some might read and either be persuaded by my words or provide a persuasive argument which will benefit me to hear. It's good to present examples of good deeds of presidents or parties supported so that others understand that support and possibly come around to supporting them, too. It isn't any harder than posting on any of the other things on which you do post, and likely of no less benefit.
There have been lists of things Trump's done as president. I'm not down with absolutely all of them, but imagine if more people saw those lists...like you for example. Or more especially, someone like Dan, who would then have to argue why any of them were bad ideas or be forced to accept he backed the wrong liar. (That was a joke. Trump's not a liar in any way which should detract from his benefit to America)
"If this goes through, it could be some degree of incentive for public indoctrination centers to go back to actually educating kids in that which will actually benefit them...the basic "reading' 'riting and 'rithmetic"."
While this is a theoretical possibility, the rot in the education system is deep and I suspect it'll take more than this to fix.
" Trump's proposal is but a baby step and if I'm not mistaken, it's simply to allow parents who homeschool relief from taxes ostensibly used to support public schools."
1. I'm not sure if this is Trump's proposal or someone else's that he supports.
2. The proposal I saw was to allow 529 savings accounts to be used for private or home school expenses. Not for tax relief.
3. I guess it'd be possible to do some sort of federal tax relief to offset the local school taxes, but I haven't seen a proposal to do so.
4. A tax credit would be, IMO, a much more effective and wide ranging tool than the 529 thing.
"While this is a theoretical possibility, the rot in the education system is deep and I suspect it'll take more than this to fix."
No doubt. There's no rational way to disagree with that at all.
"1. I'm not sure if this is Trump's proposal or someone else's that he supports."
Doesn't matter. It's good he's on board with it.
"2. The proposal I saw was to allow 529 savings accounts to be used for private or home school expenses. Not for tax relief."
Well, there are tax savings having such accounts, but I did stray from the point. My bad. yet those tax advantages can be regarded as some degree of reimbursement of education related taxes.
"3. I guess it'd be possible to do some sort of federal tax relief to offset the local school taxes, but I haven't seen a proposal to do so."
I don't know if there's been any formal proposals to allow tax relief for those who home school or send their kids to private/parochial schools, but the subject has been discussed for sure. My widowed mother sent four out of five kids to Catholic school for six years apiece. She certainly could have used the relief.
" 4. A tax credit would be, IMO, a much more effective and wide ranging tool than the 529 thing."
Absolutely. It does make the playing field between public schools and alternatives more even. More people would take advantage of those alternatives, which would decrease the money going to public schools since student population determines how much they routinely receive (which is why they were so pissed when I ditched).
1. Well, if your claim that this was a "Trump proposal" is inaccurate, I could see why you'd say that it "doesn't matter". I agree that this is a good idea regardless of Trump's support. But you made the claim that it was a "Trump proposal", while I see no indication of that.
2. You can play semantic games all you want. The reality is that the proposal I saw and wrote about, while a good idea, will not help those who need it most. They could be regarded as anything. But they are not a direct offset of school taxes. They also only benefit those with enough income to fund them to a level that would allow large dispersals prior to college AND allow enough to still pay for college.
3. I'm not arguing that relief isn't needed. I'm arguing that this particular proposal wouldn't help the low income families that can benefit the most from getting out of the public schools. There have been some local efforts to allow property tax $$ to go with students, but I'm not aware of anything currently being discussed on a national level.
Although Trump could go a long way toward solidifying his increased AA support by proposing such a measure.
4. That was, is, and has been my point all along. The 529 thing is good, but it's not a broad based proposal.
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