Wednesday, August 27, 2025

Maybe Muslims Have One Small Thing "Right"?

 Listened to an interesting sermon last Sunday.   One of the things that was brought out was the notion of body posture as it relates to prayer.   The pastor looked at scriptures from throughout scripture that showed how often people bowed or knelt when in prayer or similar acts.  Jesus in the garden and on the cross bowed/knelt as he prayed.  Moses on Mt. Sinai being one additional example.  

The point being made was that our body posture when praying can have an effect of how we pray.   This  is not to imply that prayers while driving or sitting or laying down aren't heard, but it seems more about how our posture shapes how we think about prayer and how we relate to YHWH.  Clearly we can't "pray without ceasing" if we are constantly on our knees, but I am seriously considering adding some prayer times where I am intentionally on my knees before YHWH.   I don't think that either the pastor or I would suggest that this is some sort of requirement, yet I'm infrequent by this.  For me, I would hope that this might help me focus my prayers and avoid distraction when I pray (at least a couple of times a day).  

 

As with things of this sort, I am concerned that I might make it transactional.   That I will go in thinking that if I only do  this one specific thing that YHWH will reward me for my actions.   That clearly seems like the wrong attitude and it'll probably be a bit of s struggle to try to keep this focused on YWHW and who He is and being confident in His sovereignty.  

Anyway, just throwing this out there because of how it struck me.   I plan to try to implement this in my prayer life and  see if it changes how I relate to YHWh and how I view my prayer time.  

 

10 comments:

Marshal Art said...

A good thing to consider, indeed! I liken it to my position regarding how we dress when attending Sunday service. I prefer to dress better than I normally do in the normal course of living my life (not referring to slumming it at home).

I do occasionally kneel when I occasionally pray (which means I acknowledge I don't "pray without ceasing". I am constantly aware of the vast chasm of separation between my God and myself. By this I'm here referring His vast power and the fact that He's the Creator of all things. I'm clearly more insignificant than the smallest insect I never even notice when compared to God. Seems to me He's deserving of some recognition of that unassailable fact and dressing as if one believes it, or kneeling as a reflection of that does the trick. Whether or not it results in Holy Brownie Points is not the issue or concern for me. I just want Him to know what I think of Him, and these are ways to do that which aren't hard to do.

As to how I dress for Sunday service, I live in an area which has been consistently in the high 90s for most of the summer. Wearing a sport coat and tie seems almost masochistic, but fortunately, the church AC is wonderful (though most women bring sweaters), so there's really no excuse aside from the fact that few of my better clothes don't fit well (I'm working on that).

Craig said...

I agree that there are some parallels around how we dress at church.

Like I said, I don't think that you can't pray from other postures or whatever, but like so much about prayer it's more about how it shapes you than how it affects YHWH. As I've got a few things that I'm somewhat earnestly praying about right now it seems like it could be perceived as transactional and I need to try not to make it that.

How I dress depends on whether or not I'm up in from to some degree. I usually dress somewhere in the business casual realm, but step it up a bit when I'm up front. Our church generally leans toward the casual side of things, and I try not to go too far down that path.

Marshal Art said...

"Whatever you ask for..."

There is definitely a transactional aspect to some prayer, specifically when we ask God for one thing or another as we are encouraged to do (generally speaking). If you intend as a matter of practice to abide His Will, I don't see how asking for anything can be transactional, unless I'm misunderstanding your meaning. As that may be the case, if you're praying in a manner which sets your obedience as conditional against prayers being answered, that would be a problem. But if you're already obedient to the best of your ability, where is the barter?

As to the church I now attend, it's a mix, with mostly the older dudes wearing jackets and ties. The pastor usually has a jacket on, but not always a tie, and when the pastor from another location substitutes, he's usually in a polo shirt. But it's just a personal thing for me, though I do occasionally look askance at some sartorial choices of other attendees.

Craig said...

I'd argue that the context of the "whatever you ask for" indicates that those asks need to be within the will and plan of YHWH, not a blank check. As Stan notes today, there are better ways to ask things of YHWH. Where I think of it being transactional is when we think "If I pray this specific prayer, or pray in this specific posture, or anoint myself with this specific oil, or if I give $X dollars to the poor, that I'll get exactly what I want. That's what I'm trying to avoid. I want to do this for the right reason, rightly give YHWH His due, not because I want something. I don't think that asking for things, even specific things, is generally transactional. But the "I'll go join the priesthood if you'll take away my hangover." kind of thing is what I'm trying to avoid.

I'd also suggest that it can be an individual thing, what might be appropriate for one person, might not for another. In this case, I'm talking about myself and how I personally approach things as opposed to suggesting that others do what I do.

Obviously, this presupposes a God who interacts with us in a supernatural way and a God who cares enough to provide our needs, listen to our wants, and provide for us in ways the bring Him glory.

I rarely pay much attention to what other attenders wear, as that's between them and YHWH. I do, however, think that there should be some minimum level of "dress code" for anyone who is up front in any sort of leadership role.

But again, that's me.

Marshal Art said...

To get it out of the way, I don't do much in the way of questioning anyone's choice of clothes. I simply see it...because it's often not possible not to see it...and immediately a review comes to mind all by itself. That review is certainly based on how I was raised and what I've come to believe about the disparity between God and myself...such that I am cognizant of the fact that He's not just some dude on the street, but Someone much more essential to my well being. As such, He's worth a bit more than whatever I pull out of the hamper. Humility is what I'm saying. I feel I need be humble before my Lord in attitude and regard for Him (not dressing like a humble beggar). Thus, kneeling in prayer is part of that humbleness. Recall that Moses was not keen on being bold when first he "met" the Lord in the burning bush.

Yet, I would love to have the issue come up more often in conversation, and it would be a great topic in a sermon or teaching, in my humble opinion.

As to asking God for things in prayer, I've come to believe I can ask Him for anything, but for whatever it I do ask of Him, I acknowledge that it's all up to Him to decide whether He should grant me my request. Whatever He wants is fine with me.

At the same time, I don't think it's possible for there not to be some sort of transaction regardless of what we ask and for what reason. If all we ask is that He helps us to be what He wants us to be, how are we not benefiting by His compliance with such a request? I don't worry about it so much, and I think I'm covered by accepting He might not see fit to provide as I've requested. Just as in any other situation, not asking is an automatic "No".

By way of example, I still buy Lotto tickets. There was a time when the amount I'd spend was equal to how bad a day I had at work. But then I came to realize that if He wants me to have great wealth, I don't need to buy more than one ticket, and buying hundreds won't make it anymore guaranteed, as one can always be on the wrong side of the odds. I don't necessarily pray for a winning ticket, but He knows I'd like to have one. Regardless of the outcome, I'm still His.

Craig said...

I don't either as a general rule because I see it as an issue of Christian liberty to a great degree. I would prefer that the churches I play at have some sort of (minimal) standards for those leading, but I'm not in a position to push that.

I don't think we should ask Him anything, but almost anything. It seems clear that we should not ask for things that violate His commandments or is likely to be outside of His will. While we can ask, we need to be prepared for an answer that might not be what we want it to be and to gratefully accept the answer and offer thanks to Him.

I occasionally buy lottery tickets, but don't pray for a win. The most I'll do is acknowledged that a win is one possible way that He could choose to help me.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

I agree about dressing better for church. I know there are those who can't afford much more than their daily clothes so I'm not condemning them, but when I see elders, especially, who dress less formally than I do, it sort of bothers me because I think they should set the example.
In good weather I wear a shirt with a tie, and slacks. Temperature determines whether shirt is long or short sleeve. With the long sleeve, again temperature determines whether I wear a waistcoat or jacket. When temperatures are less than about 54 degrees, I wear turtleneck under a nice sweater, along with a favorite necklace-- a silver chain with sterling Christian fish-- replacing a tie.

Craig said...

I'm not sure that it's as much about the specifics of what you wear as it is about putting the thought into the decision and doing it out of respect for YHWH and the church.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Oh, I fully agree about the reason for decision vs specifics.

Craig said...

I assumed so.